Mouse suggestions: updated

"phenotyp" (phenotyp) 04/29/2019 at 15:40 • Filed to: Computerlopnik, Mouse, hardware, recommenations, sketch

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Quick sketchbook doodle for your time and input.

Apparently, even after taking it apart and cleaning it, the latest Uhuru mouse’s middle button is starting to fail. Doesn’t work well with web or CAD. (Sometime’s it’s fine, sometimes it fails).

Looking for good mouse suggestions. Right now I’m using a Fenifox, which is good for everything but CAD.

So I’ve had YET ANOTHER mouse’s middle button fail. Seems to be the primary failure point for the last few years. Of course, I need a middle button (and scroll) that FUCKING WORKS, doing CAD, and etc.

I need a small form factor mouse, that’s gonna last me more than 6-8 months. I’ve had two Uhurus like this, and #3 will be here Monday:

I mean, for $13... it’s really not bad. Nice-enough feel, they keep improving them (#2 was much nicer than #1, we’ll see what #3 brings...)

I had these to replace the Microsoft Studio Mouse that I’d used prior, which was more comfortable, better-built, more expensive, and the spindle that holds the middle wheel still fucking broke after like 7 months.

(one of these)

I really like Microsoft’s mice at the beginning, but they break so fast.

I had two gen-1 Arc mice, back when, and they’re still my favorite mouse, period, hands-down, as far as function and ergo. But both of them had lasers that failed after... 6-8 months, and they’ve been out of production for years.

(But seriously. Ever use one of those? They’re GREAT. )

So, Oppo. Recommend me a good mouse, that will last more than 6-8 months, Bluetooth, that’s small enough to run with (no gloopy gaming mice, all I need is 3-button/scroll, don’t want any BS capacitive shit)...

Help me out. I got work to do.

PS9 > phenotyp 03/09/2019 at 15:46

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Try logitech. I’ve dropped my wireless gaming mouse like a billion times on a stone tile floor and it refuses to break. A gaming mouse might be gauche for work, but they’re solid if you can get over that.

Another idea is just take $1-200 or so and have a box of cheap mice nearby when the middle button inevitably fails again. 

Chariotoflove > phenotyp 03/09/2019 at 15:48

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I’m a track pad user. I like not having to worry about free space for the mouse to roam.

My wife likes a Logitech trackball. It gives good support to her wrist while mousing around with her thumb only. Takes getting used to though. 

TheRealBicycleBuck > Chariotoflove 03/09/2019 at 15:55

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I was the only weirdo using a trackball for gaming. It eventually died and Logitech wasn’t making new ones for many years. After they finally started making new trackballs, I’d already converted to a mouse. 

PS9 > Chariotoflove 03/09/2019 at 15:57

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I wanted to give those a try, but JFC $200 is a lot for a mouse alternative. Mac users get a break there since Apple’s is $50 less. 

404 - User No Longer Available > PS9 03/09/2019 at 15:58

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I concur. My 12 -year old Logitech G5 is still kicking around. The mouse wheel is a bit wonky as some of the bearing grease came out, but cleaned it up and it works like a charm again.

Variance > phenotyp 03/09/2019 at 15:58

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I’m not sure if this is still too large for your needs, but my recommendation would be the Logitech MX Anywhere. It’s relatively expensive, but Logitech is worth it.

https://www.logitech.com/en-us/product/mx-anywhere-2s-flow

phenotyp > Chariotoflove 03/09/2019 at 16:07

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Trackballs, while maybe more comfortable, are 100% unuseful for me doing CAD and stuff on the go. I need a small, comfortable, Bluetooth (NO RF DONGLE) mouse.

Chariotoflove > PS9 03/09/2019 at 16:09

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It many times when the Apple choice costs less.

I like mine a lot. 

Chariotoflove > phenotyp 03/09/2019 at 16:10

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I can see that. I don’t really like them for general use either. That’s why my and my wife’s devices coexist on the desk. 

phenotyp > Chariotoflove 03/09/2019 at 16:21

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Only Apple product here is the iphone; I’m 100% MS otherwise.

Always cracked me up when all the engineers I worked with in SF used MBPros, but booted to windows because they had to, y’know, work .

I mean, I get it. Pretty hardware. But I guess I’d prioritize the work over the appearances.

phenotyp > PS9 03/09/2019 at 16:25

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I wish I didn’t hate Logitech for no real reason. Somehow they’ve always been jusr off enough that I can’t seem to like their stuff. But it’s been a couple years. I had one of their RF keyboards. I kinda hate their mice. Maybe I should give them another go.

Chariotoflove > phenotyp 03/09/2019 at 16:33

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There is absolutely nothing about Windows that makes it inherently more robust or capable for work than MacOS. The only reasons people have to boot into Windows come from environments that are structured with an MS bias and/or use Windows specific software. Many times IT departments actively work to exclude Macs so they don’t have to support  more than one platform. 

phenotyp > Chariotoflove 03/09/2019 at 16:37

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Solidworks was (may still be?) windows-only. That was the bottleneck.

Chariotoflove > phenotyp 03/09/2019 at 16:57

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That’s historically been an issue. Specialty software c ompanies often focus their efforts on one platform. During the dark years of MacOS, many companies that were Mac-first, or even Mac-only in their beginnings followed the market share into Windows and left the Mac versions to languish or die . I keep VM Ware Fusion emulator running Windows  on my work computer for those times when I have to boot up a piece of Bio-Rad analysis software for the CFX96 machine in my lab because the company can’t be bothered to make an OSX version. Fortunately, that’s a rare occurrence anymore.

Maxima Speed > phenotyp 03/09/2019 at 18:36

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Ahem..... I’ll just leave this here.

phenotyp > Maxima Speed 03/09/2019 at 19:37

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*ahem*

Need a middle button and scroll whee l for CAD.

Maxima Speed > phenotyp 03/09/2019 at 20:35

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Apple doesn t car e about your plebeian “needs”.

phenotyp > Maxima Speed 03/09/2019 at 22:29

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Of course they don’t

RiceRocketeer Extraordinaire > phenotyp 03/09/2019 at 23:53

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Longtime Logitech user here. Their mice vary widely in click feel and sensor sensitivity. Their higher end models with better sensors have much smoother cursor movement, but at the moment I’m using one of their “silent” click models that also lets me switch between multiple devices. Their cheap mice feel ... well, cheap.

They also have issues with the click switches wearing down prematurely in some models - I’d check the Amazon reviews before committing to buy one .

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > phenotyp 03/11/2019 at 13:45

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Only reason I changed from my M705 was because I needed to move to a “handshake” mouse for wrist strain. I miss the Logitech...

for Michigan > PS9 03/21/2019 at 18:04

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I’ma jump on this bandwagon. I have two Lo gitech wireless  mice, one compact and one full size, that are pushing 8 years old and still going strong. 

Nibby > Maxima Speed 04/29/2019 at 15:44

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those are absolutely awful to use for pretty much anything, super uncomfortable

Nibby > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 15:45

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definitely not small but I love my Steelseries rival 110 mouse... it’s $30 and precise. High quality too

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 15:47

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I only buy logitech, never had any issue.

I have 3 logitech mice currently all working well.

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > Maxima Speed 04/29/2019 at 15:47

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Hey you dropped your suppository

Akio Ohtori - RIP Oppo > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 15:49

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I’ve been a huge fan of the Logitech MX Anywhere and its variants. Small, but not too small, works on glass, and you can switch between smooth and ratcheting scroll on the wheel. That said, recently I’ve become an old, so I’ve switched to a “handshake” mouse. Takes some getting used to, but it is much more natural. I’ve been using the Anker ones , but my upstairs one has been getting angry after playing too many video games. There are a lot of players in this space now so that might be worth a look.

EDIT: Just noticed your “no dongle” requirement. The MX is available in bluetooth but the Anker isn’t. I’m sure someone else makes a BT vertical mouse , but I can’t recommend anything specific.

TorqueToYield > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 15:49

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https://www.costco.com/Logitech-Performance-Plus-Mouse.product.100396338.html

This shape mouse from Logitech is so so nice to hold and Costco has it for $30.

HammerheadFistpunch > Nibby 04/29/2019 at 15:51

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agreed, these are the worst

TorqueToYield > Maxima Speed 04/29/2019 at 15:52

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Because nobody ever needs to use a wireless mouse while it’s charging....

HammerheadFistpunch > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 15:52

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im Logitech mx all the way. comfort, durability, accuracy.

and 100 more > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 16:02

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I use a Logitech M510 that I carry between work and home. I was loathe to try using a wireless mouse because of lag, but this doesn’t seem to have any lag at all. I use it for CAD all day long. It does require their proprietary USB dongle, but it’s tiny (similar to the stowed inside the arc mou se above).

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 16:09

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I have been using this one for ages, I think I’ve been through 3 in the last 8 years.

https://www.amazon.com/Logitech-M510-Wireless-Computer-Mouse/dp/B003NR57BY

vicali > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 16:10

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GIS Trackball M570 user here, works great for everything except annoying, super detailed, drive you crazy kind of digitizing.. basically CAD.

Good luck in your search.

415s30 W123TSXWaggoIIIIIIo ( •_•))°) > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 16:27

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I work on shows, I have done the Apple show here in SF/San Jose several times. They are a bunch of pricks, I have a Samsung and I am not happy my wife has an iphone . I have never had anything Apple, military didn’t use it and I learned on a Compaq in the 80's. My aunt worked for them so we had everything from the suitcase computer on up when I was younger. I’ve had a string of 17" Toshiba laptops with no issues.

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 17:10

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For mice, I recommend you go with a ‘Roderick’:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tales_of_the_Riverbank

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 18:10

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https://www.amazon.com/ELECOM-M-HT1DRBK-Wireless-Trackball-Mouse/dp/B0735584RM

Just got one of these ELECOM HUGE wireless trackballs a few months ago, (made in japan, lots of japanese writing on the packaging)

I figured it would keep my wrist and forearm more stable, and also have more dexterity with the index finger position, compared to a thumb-driven trackball.

I like it. I am thinking about getting the smaller, but Bluetooth-enabled DEFT trackballs and a small case to put it in, to stash it in my laptop bag, so that I can leave the HUGE on my desk.

It is different than a mouse, but with a bit of re-orientation, I quite like it. Left click, scroll, back and forward, and trackball speed settings under thumb, navigating around the screen with index or two fingers, right click under middle or ring finger. It is a bit more like gestures than a mouse , without being a trackpad.

mice and trackballs seem to get more precise fine motion control and cursor drag than trackpads, and you don’t have to lift your “ click-and-drag” when you run out of room on the trackpad.

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 18:37

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I ran a laptop program at a design school for more than a decade.

I dispatched 100+ MacBook Pros per YEAR with dual-boot for a reason.

The hardware WORKED, and LASTED. (granted that was before the butterfly keyboard and touch-strip function key re-design)

Students who wanted to use MacOS, but needed AutoCAD could dual boot.

Students who wanted to use Windows, could stay in Windows, and it was basically a powerhouse aluminum PC.

Students who realized that they didn’t like Windows that much, and their friends were doing cool things in iMovie or whatever... could reboot and use MacOS for themselves, instead of being locked into windows on a plastic PC laptop, which no option to convert.

I could re-image Mac or Windows, in a variable partition and give them whichever preference they wanted at any time during the program.

We had Dell, HP, and for a sad period before they went under, Gateway computers...

None of them held up the way Apples did, and frankly, once BootCamp allowed running Windows natively, with Apple drivers... it was the best, fastest, and most reliable PC on the market. It cost more, but even warranty coverage was better, quicker, and less hassle... but no accidental damage coverage.

I had STUDENTS who were incredibly hard on equipment that could get 5-6 years out of a MacBook Pro... where the PC plastic computers were cracked, damaged, failing, and overheating by year 3. Try supporting inherent overheating GPUs on Gateway laptops when the company had just been bought out and split up... and the parts are no longer available...

And other than AutoDesk, if they used Mac OS, especially for Adobe programs... the software experience was better, faster, and more consistent as well, and MUCH less prone to driver issues, general OS bloat and slow-down, or security intrusions from malware and viruses.

I still alternate between my older 15" MacBook Pro and my newer 12" Surface Pro tablet, even in my current job, and I am the only one who opted for a Mac .

The surface may be a bit more versatile, hardware wise, and runs a couple of pieces of software that developers won’t write for Mac OS... but for Mac OS is still better integrated, and more intuitive, and iOS is just downright EASY, relatively stable, and secure.

Windows 10 on the surface pro is more powerful than iOS, and more portable than a full-size laptop piece of hardware, but it is still Windows... and it is still Windows 10, where crap is hidden in 3 different levels of menus, half new, half legacy, behind an icon that only appears every other tuesday when squinting sideways at the screen... and then when it does come up, the text scaling is wrong, and almost too small to be seen on the high-res screen ... and if you adjust the magnification or the screen resolution, the things that were otherwise working right get screwed up instead. Not to mention AirPlay mirroring to AppleTV even in ad-hoc wireless mode , compared to Windows projecting to DLNA screens, or Microsoft’s own wireless video adapter, which both randomly fail in meetings.

phenotyp > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. 04/29/2019 at 21:19

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Oh, I get it. I’ve designed more computers over the years than I care to count. I really like my surfacebook 2, though the aluminum is soft, and more prone to dings than I’d like.

Mostly I’m looking for non-Logitech, not-too-spendy mouse suggestions; something with a middle button that won’t crap out after a few months. And not hideous, and will fit in the pocket of my laptop bag. 

phenotyp > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. 04/29/2019 at 21:20

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I know a few engineers who swear by their trackballs, but man. I can’t do it. Plus portability’s a big issue. 

phenotyp > HammerheadFistpunch 04/29/2019 at 21:22

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Yeah, I can’t really explain my dislike of Logitech stuff... I just don’t like em.

Irrational, for sure, given how many MS mice I’ve been through. 

phenotyp > Nibby 04/29/2019 at 21:24

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Wired? Because that’s a no-go. 

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 22:39

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Between the standard cheap Logitech stuff on most workstations at my workplace, the Eletek trackball I requisitioned to avoid said cheap Logitech mouse, and the trackpads I use on most laptops... half the time being someone else’s machine that I am fixing....

You have more experience with good portable wireless mice than I do.

T he only thing I can think of as an alternative to the breaking scroll wheel issue would be something like the Microsoft Explorer Touchmouse. Something with a haptic touchpad scroll, instead of a moving part, but I am not sure which one would fit your portability, small size, and small price point goals.

Or Microsoft Arc Touchmouse, which might be similar to your favored arc... but I understand hesitance after previous quality issues with Microsoft branded hardware. (all of their peripherals are manufactured by various sub-contracted manufacturers, as far as I am aware.)

Now I see that you don’t want the capacitive stuff... sorry, I missed that.

Nibby > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 22:50

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wireless mice are lame

phenotyp > Nibby 04/29/2019 at 23:07

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Only option.

phenotyp > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. 04/29/2019 at 23:15

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Yeah, those things are FUUUUUUUCCCKING terrible.

I need a physical scroll+button. I absolutely hate those capacitve things.

I might just have to get another MS Studio/Surface mouse and suck it up again in 6 months when the middle button’s axle breaks.

Again.

Nibby > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 23:17

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3487 USB extenders

BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 23:17

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Just fab up some micro-bearing carriers, and lathe up a titanium axle... do some mouse mods. :-)

phenotyp > BoxerFanatic, troublesome iconoclast. 04/29/2019 at 23:21

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I’ve taken so many apart, at this point, I’m about ready to fab up my own.

Here’s a modular, super-ergonomic mouse I designed a while back:

I’m still hoping I get one. I really liked how it felt. If they get the tracking and battery right, I’m all-in.

phenotyp > Nibby 04/29/2019 at 23:36

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I need my USBs for work . Only have the 2 on the Surfacebook.

Nibby > phenotyp 04/29/2019 at 23:40

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USB hubs exist

phenotyp > Nibby 04/29/2019 at 23:43

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More shit to carry. No go.

Nibby > phenotyp 04/30/2019 at 00:00

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get one of these

phenotyp > Nibby 04/30/2019 at 00:26

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Sounds about right.

wbizarre - OEM fetishist > phenotyp 05/10/2019 at 19:37

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I used to get logitechs, maybe 4 or 5 over the past several years. I found that the main buttons pretty consistently start to fail after about 2 years. I do still have a compact Logitech that’s hanging in there - I like it for CAD, and I love their switchable smooth/clicky scroll wh eel.

I also tried an Anker vertical mouse, and loved it, but it had some button issues as well, so I didn’t keep it.